Hey ya'll. I joined this site to ask this simple question:

I currently own a P&H Scorpio. I live a few feet from Everglades National Park, a place where oysters come up to kiss kayaks at every low tide and plastic makes mucho sense. Well, I was offered a 2006 Nordkapp LV for an unbelievably low price, and wonder if I'd be a fool to pass up this opportunity. Being poor, this means I must sell my Scorpio.

Specs:
6'2
180lbs
33" inseam
33" waist
28y/o and relatively athletic
certifiably masochistic

Am I losing versatility or gaining everything? I know little about expensive kayaks because I didn't plan on owning one until retirement. Does my size simply make this LV impractical as a touring boat? Is this too much boat for someone with only a year's experience at sea? Has anyone paddled both these enough to fairly compare them? Thoughts? Ideas? Help! kayaking community. Let me drink from your founts of knowledge!

Thanks.

Kris

Is the Nordkapp glass and is it in really good shape? Just how low is the price? If it is truly a killer price and you fit in it, yes I would say it is an upgrade. I've paddled a lot of boats and the Nordkapp is one that lives up to its reputation.

But you will have to decide if your paddling locations are more suitable to the P&H, which I assume is poly, or assuming the Valley boat is composite, are you good with it around those oyster shells?

I personally will never buy another Valley product. I bought a brand new Valley Nordkapp poly boat. The hatches are amazing. And the way they layer the poly makes the boat very strong and rigid for a poly boat. However, in my case Valley provided me with a boat that had a warped stern. Given the lines of the boat I didn't realize it when I picked the boat up. Valley would NOT warranty the boat. They basically told me to go "F" myself. I can assure you that in no way did I damage the boat. Even the owner of the store could tell that no one damaged the boat and he agreed with me that it looked like this issue occurred during production. The owner did take the boat back and I got a Tempest 170 instead. But the owner of the store absorbed the loss on the boat. I don't think it was fair to him. Any company that sells a product but won't stand by their product won't receive my business. Valley can kiss my butt. I am just glad I didn't end up being out nearly $2000.00.

Chad,that's pretty much why I asked Steppenwolf if the Nordkapp in question is composite (glass). You are absolutely right about poly boats, but Valley isn't the only manufacturer who has problems with their plastic boats. I've also seen bent P&H, Old Town, and probably others that look like the warped keel line must have come that way from the factory. That certainly doesn't mean they are all that way, but when this happens, it should be caught at the factory, or at least at the dealer. I happened to be at a dealer when they received a shipment of boats and they went over them very carefully to assure that each boat was straight, etc. I assume this is because they've been burned a time, or two. This was not a Valley, nor P&H dealer.

I don't mean to dump on any of the manufacturers mentioned, nor polyethylene boats in general, because I happen to own a couple of poly boats that are very well built and one in particular that is still as straight and fair as the day I bought it. Not that the other has changed, but it had a couple of very minor imperfections when I bought it.

I might get in trouble for this, but Current Designs seems to have their poly boats down to a science and they are single layer. I'm sure they've probably had their troubles too with that material, but in my experience, I don't recall seeing any of their plastic boats that were crooked.

Lest anyone believe that composite boats are immune from deformities and flaws, think again. Under the very best of circumstances and with the best craftsmen available, I would imagine it is very trying to produce totally flawless boats and stay within a cost parameter. I'd better end this rambling before I mention a brand that does an exceptional job of making the best boats possible--that for sure would get me in trouble.

I fully understand that flaws will occur one way or another. It happens. In my case it was a poly Nordkapp. The fact that Valley would not stand by a flawed product that they sold leaves a bad taste in my mouth. One would think that a company with the reputation that Valley has would care a bit more about their customer service.
For me a straight keel line is too important. Other flaws or blemishes may not have been so important and could have easily been remedied or just wouldn't have mattered. I had no desire to spend that kind of money to paddle in a circle.
My Tempest 170 is also poly. Although the hatches aren't as water tight as Valley hatches and the overall condition of the kayak isn't as rigid or durable as the Nordkapp it does have a straight keel and I love paddling it.

To Chad and Magooch; My assumption, due to Valleys QA/QC standards, is that Valley shipped a boat with a straight keel and that it was damaged during shipping.

When a manufacturer ships goods, either by ship, truck or rail, the shipping company then assumes responsibility for those goods and any damage to them. When those goods are delivered the receiver is responsible for inspecting them and accepting them or rejecting them and filing a claim with the shipper. Once the goods are accepted the responsibility falls solely on the receiver, in this case the retailer. What does happen to poly boats is that they get placed in the top tier on a ship (which is not supposed to happen as that is in the shipping directions)due to their light weight and the container gets HOT! I've seen the end result of this a time or too. Unfortunately, the damage is not always so obvious and a few may end up accepted by said retailer. It would be unreasonable for Valley to be held responsible due to improper shipping. Those are the stone cold facts of shipping reality.

To get to the questions about composite boats vs plastic; The prevailing idea that plastic boats wear better than composite is not entirely accurate. As some of the other folks here know, I'm extraordinarily hard on my equipment and have a tendency to bash my composite boats off of rocks...hard (Valley guality = tough boat, they didn't get that reputation for nothing). I do have to repair the damage from time to time - something you can't do with layered boats, generally speaking. Also, I've dragged it across rocks and barnacles with little to no damage to the hull. If there is damage, I can repair it.

Plastic boats have a bit of give and are preferred by some for rock gardening as the can absorb blows that will damage composite boats, which is why it has become the preferred material for WW boats though there are still composite WW boats on the market. The soft material, though will shave, away quickly when dragged across sharp objects...like oyster shells.