#1963 - 09/22/09 07:34 AM
Review: Epic 16X
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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As I've reported, my two previous kayaks (Dirigo 17 and custom CLC Patuxent) are with their new owners, who report themselves very pleased with them. I paddled the Patuxent (17' long, 22" beam, hard chines) most of the year, and the Dirigo (17' long, 26" beam) during drysuit season. Both boats, though, were getting to be Very Heavy, and my goal was to replace them with a single craft. I was looking for a shorter, lighter, hard-chine boat with a rudder, and a slightly wider beam than 22" for the increased stability it would provide for cold-water winter paddling.
After trying several boats, I test-paddled the Epic 16X extensively twice, then bought it. It answers all the above requirements except for a hard-chine hull. The 2008 SK review of the Epic 18X, the boat Freya H. is paddling around Australia, pretty much covers all the bases for the 16X, but here are a few additional comments--
SK is right about the comfort and utility of the seat and the rudder foot controls; it is the most comfortable seat I've yet been in, and the rudder controls/footrest combo is unique and perfectly fulfills the tasks of providing a rigid anchor for the feet and also can't-go-wrong rudder control. The sliding seat can be moved front-and-back to get optimum seat-pedal distance if/when you switch from legs-splayed to legs-together/knees up posture.
I use kayak rudders as variable-azimuth skegs on open water, and only steer with the rudder in narrow, twisting saltmarsh channels. The Epic articulated-stern rudder is very good for this sort of paddling. There is still a question as to whether the rudder is deep enough in the water for boat control in steep following seas; Epic is reportedly working on a retrofit rudder. I've not yet had a problem. Another cause for attention is the possible fragility of the rudder itself, in that it does not flip up out of harm's way when not in use--the rudder is always deployed, so you have to be careful of grinding against rocks, etc. when coming ashore. I've already altered my coming-ashore routine to favor the rudder, and I tie it up with a spacer between the rudder and the hull stern when transporting the boat.
The Epic 16X handles very well in a seaway, in busy chop, in crosswinds (no weathercocking in winds that always induced weathercocking in my two other boats). It surfs chop cleanly, and, due to its light weight and acceleration, I can jump from wave to wave more easily than in my Patuxent. It has a higher maintainable top speed also, so I can easily catch up with my paddling partners (Nordkapp and Caribou, usually) if I fall behind while looking at birds or whatever. And monster cargo-carrying space is available.
Workmanship has been an issue with some Epic boats. They've either solved the problem, or are now hyperinspecting their boats. I went over my boat with a fine-tooth comb prior to purchase, and the finish is exemplary. I've replaced the wimpy deck bungees with thicker ones.
I don't know what Epic had in mind when they designed the 16X--the 18X is clearly a go-fast boat that seems to be doing just fine around Australia (so far). But it's working out very well for me as a touring/exploring boat that's stable, easy to get on/off the Forester roof, load up with stuff, surf chop, paddle all day in all kinds of water and wind, and keep up with or outrun my paddling partners. It's not perfect, but, for me, it's close to perfect. And, it doesn't look like everybody else's boat.
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#1971 - 09/28/09 11:13 AM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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I like the review, thanks for sharing... Just curious, have you pushed the boat to it's limit in a sprint, and perhaps figured out what you think it's limit is with GPS ? Also, is it really only available in white or something?
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#1976 - 09/28/09 04:52 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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Mitch, I've had the boat at sprint speed a couple of times, but I don't have a clue as to how fast I was going (no GPS). The kayak is for "touring paddlers" (that's me) in the Epic literature, offering "a unique combination or stability, maneuverability and speed". I was out with the 16X today, under the most severe conditions I've yet had it in--15-knot SSW wind, with gusts to 20 knots (anemometer). Handled just fine, no weathercocking at all, reasonable progress into the wind, then fine surfing on the return run. Just running downwind with my paddle across my shoulders to catch the wind was about the fastest I've run downwind yet. Had to be ready to brace, though, as conditions were squirrelly, but the windsurfers and kite board sailors were out in full force (Barnegat Bay, NJ).
Colors: the hull comes only in white, but you have a choice of red (me), yellow, or white deck.
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#2153 - 12/01/09 11:26 AM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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Thanks for responding, I like this review a lot because it answers a lot of questions asked about this boat. Currently I have a nice plastic er I mean "Corelite" P&H which is nice but I'm thinking of Epic as my next boat.
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#2156 - 12/01/09 04:54 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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Mitch, some more thoughts on the Epic: if they asked me, I'd tell Epic to replace the three-quarter-inch webbing that secures the two hatch covers with full one-inch webbing and also maybe re-think the buckle system that secures the hatch covers--like going with 3 straps for the big rear hatch cover. There is also some leakage into the compartments when big water or rain is heavy. No boat is perfect. But the more I paddle my 16X, the happier I am with it.
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#2224 - 01/05/10 11:19 AM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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Mitch, there is molding on the right rear deck of the Epics where a day hatch was perhaps planned, but then cancelled. Freya and Epic had agreed on a customized 18X for her Australia trip, but it hadn't been ready in time for the launch, so she started with a stock 18X. About halfway around, the custom boat replaced the stock boat, and I'm guessing that she had asked that the day hatch be installed as part of the custom work. I guess we'll find out sometime what else the custom boat had.
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#2252 - 01/12/10 08:53 AM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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Ah I see... thanks for the info. I'm still considering this boat heavily... Though justifying it is yet another matter... lol
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#2255 - 01/12/10 01:52 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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By coincidence, an occasional paddling partner of mine called to ask me about my 16X--he had been up to Maine and paddled an 18X (Ultra layup) and liked it a lot, but wanted to know what I knew. I told him basically all that I've posted here, but warned him that Epic advises care with the Ultra layup, as it's just not as robust as the regular (but still very light) layup. He said he knows about that, and has read every scrap of Epic literature on the kayaks. So, who knows? There may be another Epic on local waters soon. And maybe yet another?? I wouldn't myself get the Ultra layup--too fragile and way too pricey--and the regular layup is pounds lighter than equivalent boats anyway.
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#2259 - 01/13/10 08:05 AM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 637
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Magic, I think your advice is right on. Not that I know anything about composite layups, but I did have a very good conversation with one of the fellas who built my Expedition. He pointed out the pluses and minuses of glass, kevlar and carbon. In their experience, the best bang for the buck is with e-glass cloth and vinylester resin. The weight difference is very slight, but other issues, such as potential repairs and moisture wicking are much better with glass. I mean to say that wicking is much less a problem with glass than with kevlar.
I've come to realize that there is always going to be a compromise between weight and strength, or rigidity. You would probably agree that a glass covered wood boat is hard to beat on those issues, but then there are other aspects that are compromised with that method.
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#2383 - 04/11/10 05:01 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: magooch]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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16X Update: I've made two improvements to my 16X that have made a good boat better. First, I had noticed that, in the feet-splayed position, with the knee/thigh braces in use, I did not have the same excellent foot-to-pedal contact that I did when paddling in the knees-together position. I needed a way to bring the pedal surfaces closer to my feet along the pedals' outer, upper corners. Solution--at a hardware store, I bought two porcelain knobs, about 1 and 1/2 inches in diameter and about an inch high, and some neoprene and fiber washers. I drilled a hole in the upper, outer corner of each pedal and installed the knobs. My feet now nicely contact the pedals. Problem totally solved.
Second improvement was to deal with the difficulty (especially in cold, wet weather) of opening up the straps that hold down the hatch covers, and removing the hatches. Solution--bought some 3/4 inch webbing snap-clips, and, using fabric glue and sewing with needle and thread, incorporated the snap-clips into the strapping system that secures the hatch covers. Now I just release the tension on the webbing via the cam locks that are stock on the boat, then unclip the snap-clips. I then just fold back the now-separated webbing and remove the hatch covers. Owners of 16Xs and 18Xs will know exactly what the problem was.
I briefly met Greg Barton at Paddlesport here in Jersey in March, and outlined my suggestions; also my view that Epic needs to beef up the deck bungees. Don't know if my suggestions registered--it was a busy time for all--but here they are again.
My friend who was thinking about getting an 18X, having tried one and having talked to me about my 16X, placed an order for an 18X Sport, in the standard layup. He's a big, strong, hefty guy, and he should be able to make that boat fly. Looking for it in June or maybe July.
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#2567 - 07/29/10 12:56 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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HEY! Thanks for the updates!!! Can you post pictures of your changes ? What does your buddy think of his 18X sport... Also what is the "standard layup" I guess I'm unsure of the differences ..
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#2569 - 07/29/10 12:58 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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PS> I guess you meant Standard over "Sport" ? Have you tried timing your speed ? Also what kind of paddle are you using ?
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#2578 - 07/30/10 05:04 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: NYCmitch25]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 458
Loc: New Jersey
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Mitch, the Sport is the slightly wider version of the 18X--22 and 3/4th" beam, rather than the 22" beam of the narrower boat. My friend ordered the Sport. He's going with the standard fiberglass layup, not the Ultra layup.
I've no GPS and have never tried timing myself in the 16X; I'm just happy to be able to outrun my usual paddling partners (when I feel like it). Subjectively it seems to crank right along when I really push it.
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#2593 - 08/03/10 04:00 PM
Re: Review: Epic 16X
[Re: Strange_Magic]
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Forum Participant
Registered: 09/03/09
Posts: 84
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Thanks, I'm thinking of selling my current Kayak and get the 18X, do you recommend that ?
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