I think people give those small 9-10' rec kayaks a bad rap for one reason- inadequate floatation. And often begenners choose these for their first kayak. People often say that they are dangerous for ocean use. HOWEVER, if floatation through float bags were installed on these kayaks, they could become fun little surfing machines, and just as safe as a 17' sea kayak. I hate it when people bring them down because they can sink but hasnt anyone thought that this is a perfectly correctable thing?? The kayak itself is ussually well designed, and lots of fun. I think if some sort of bow and stern floatation just Came with the kayak stock, it would give them a much better rap. Because I notice that on long sea kayaks, they just break through the waves. But on these short little kayaks with flat hulls, they ride on top of waves and bounce around alot. They actually seem like more fun in rough water than expedition kayaks, and as long as floatation is added, its perfectly safe. Heck, padding could be added to the sides so they could be rolled- and they could become like miniature sea kayaks. because if small SOTs can surf, so can a 9' sit in with good floatation.

I'm not trying to bash them, I like to paddle them myself. I recall enjoying the use of an Old town otter.

Isn't the real issue lots of primary stability, but very little secondary stability?

I agree that most rec kayaks could use more floatation. I am not sure that float bags are a good answer. My first kayak used float bags so I know what Im talking about. Float bags rarely stay totally inflated for long periods. They must be secured firmly inside the kayak. Friction will not hold them when things get tough. If you are smart you will check them every time you get out of your boat. Keeping them leak free on a long trip could be a problem. If open water paddling is ones goal then it would be easier, and safer, to just buy a boat that has hatches and bulkheads to start with.

I also agree with Ben. The high primary stability of a wide mostly flat bottomed boat makes novices feel secure but in beam seas they can rock so much the muscles on both sides of your torso get a real work out.

maybe the 9' boats lack good secondary stability. But my Pamlico 140 has a flat hull, and it does okay in rough waters. I think because its 14' long, being quite a bit longer than those small 9' kayaks improved secondary stability. It tends to ride on top of waves alot, but its never capsized before, even after a 3' wave comes in from the side of the boat. The boats flat hull makes it lift on top of the wave more but it holds itself fine.

Pammy, I've been following your posts for a few years and, unless things have changed (and I gather they haven't), I would say that you are missing the point. While I know you're in love with your Pamlico I can say that it would be a very difficult boat to control in heavy seas and surf.

While Sea kayaks may be a bit of work in surf, they are designed to be controllable in these conditions. However, this takes specific training and practice.

A surf boat typically has a planing (flat) hull and rails but is still narrow in comparison to your boat. An International class surf boat is 9' long and has no fins, but there are other classes of surf boat as well.

I know that you are young (still) and I say this with no rancor or condescension; you have very limited experience, especially if the bulk of your experience is on Horsetooth Reservoir or other surrounding lakes. When you get the chance I really recommend you take a ww class and when your a bit older (I realize the limitations that that age impose)take a few classes in tide races and on the open coast. I think it will be eye opening.

Regarding floatation, float bags will only solve one problem...swamping.